the Jesus Manifesto - Latest Comments in Emergent Movement as Protest

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

Chris — Wed, 09 Nov 2005 00:22:06 -0000

It's weird, because minus # 1 and # 5, that's my "most fun things to punt" list.

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

Mark Van Steenwyk — Mon, 07 Nov 2005 13:07:08 -0000

By the way, for me, toe socks are a HUGE innovation. They are on my top five "cutest things" list:

1) My wife
2) Puppies
3) Kittens
4) Baby Bunnies
5) Toe Socks

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

Van S — Mon, 07 Nov 2005 13:03:17 -0000

Blorge,

I know where you are coming from, but I'm not sure that everyone sees that landscape the same way. For me, cosmetic changes in churches (elements of style and whatnot) are superficial, but to some people the changes are profound. There are so many variables that can factor in to how people perceive change, and we need to be sensitive to that. However, from my perspective I think that the sorts of changes people trumpet as major changes are in fact minor in the grand scheme.

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

blorge — Mon, 07 Nov 2005 11:46:32 -0000

Mark,
I'm just saying that we don't always call a spade a spade. If you're making major differences, then say it, but if you're making small changes, don't call them big ones. Any pastor worth their weight in salt should have at least a cursory understanding of the ecclesial landscape and should understand that they're not offering a revolutionary new thing. Call it what it is.

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

Mon, 07 Nov 2005 04:28:38 -0000

"I find myself struggling with being associated with the emergent movement...but not because I disagree with the ideals of the movement, but because I feel that institutional expressions like Emergent--which is the face of the movement--seems to counteract some of the driving protests of the movement."

That's like you took the thoughts right out of my head. My sentiments exactly.

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

Van S — Fri, 04 Nov 2005 11:57:31 -0000

I don't mind doing things the same way...but if you're going to criticize the way things have been done, you need to offer a real alternative. I feel that many emerging churches have offered some real interesting alternatives and have been creative. But many of our most notable examples have not. My problem is that the further we move along, the less people seem willing to innovate.

Having said all that, I sometimes think that we expect too much. You and I may say that a church likes Solomon's Porch is almost the same things as a regular church...but the subtle difference are often a VERY big deal to people. Let's face it--there is a lot of differences among churches. It is all how you look at it. If we get overly simplistic it is easy to say something like: "that church is like every other church--they sing and meet together and read their bible...how is THAT new?"

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

blorge — Fri, 04 Nov 2005 11:43:14 -0000

I agree. It's like protesting dress socks by wearing striped toe-socks. They're still socks, they just have individually-seperated spaces for the toes to go into.

Re: Emergent Movement as Protest

Chris — Thu, 03 Nov 2005 16:56:07 -0000

I think the emergent movement IS a protest movement, I just think that a lot of the things they are protesting against are things they are reincarnating in a different form. For example, they may despise what happens on Sunday morning, but often that just means having something only slightly different happening on Saturday or Sunday night. A protest movement is a good thing, but without a positive vision that's significantly different, it's just a protest movement and nothing more.