Jesus Manifesto - Latest Comments in Independence day sort of

Re: Independence day sort of

MLS_123 — Sat, 18 Jul 2009 20:55:20 -0000

End the empire. Restore the republic.

Anyway, you know how many American Christians I see egging Israel on to bomb the heck out of Iran these days? Lots! They could care less about all the things scripture has to say. Politics and eschatology trumps annuls justice!

Re: Independence day sort of

Wes Ellis — Wed, 08 Jul 2009 12:03:05 -0000

I loved every sentence of this post! Just great stuff!!!
I wrote some of my own thoughts on Freedom (http://whateverisgood.blogs... before I read this and now I know I should have just linked this article.

Re: Independence day sort of

Zack Allen — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 20:39:37 -0000

Well I was always under the impression that "freedom costs a buck-o-five."

Seriously though, I think I like the heart of what you're saying here (we're offered salvation (freedom) for free), but let us not forget the great cost of that freedom. We were indeed "bought with a price."

Re: Independence day sort of

Joshua D Bau — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 13:42:34 -0000

I do not use twitter...sorry folks

Re: Independence day sort of

Aaron R. Linderman — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 11:55:27 -0000

I think a few quotations from the ol’ Declaration of Independence may be in order:

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,… That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men…. We, therefore… appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do… solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States.”

Moreover, the crimes attributed to King George III include some interesting examples:

“He has… obstruct[ed] the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither….

“He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures. He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power….

“For Quartering large bodies of armed troops among us: For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States….

“He is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.”

Justin is right that this may not exactly be Christian theology, but, Joshua, I think you would do better to argue that America has been unfaithful to the Founding, rather than arguing that the Founding is to blame for our current situation and must therefore be at odds with Christianity.

Re: Independence day sort of

paul munn — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 10:28:44 -0000

I just put together an evening prayer that we will do here next week (answering the independence day rhetoric of this weekend). I used several Psalters songs, with us singing the "Home, Home" part of "Refugee," and asked one of the young guys here to do some drumming for us.

If you're interested, the prayer is available here: "Prayer of Dependence"

Re: Independence day sort of

justin — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 01:03:13 -0000

I'm pretty sure that our founding documents state that that freedoms they laid out are granted from our creator... the government was there essentially to be the violent arm of God to protect those rights. Still not a correct understanding of things, but originally it was better than what we now how (the government exists to protect us from everything, even our own stupidity)

its just too bad that the citizens of this nation don't believe that anymore. blind trust in authority typically leads to negative ends.

Re: Independence day sort of

Monique — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 19:44:10 -0000

Bravo!

Re: Independence day sort of

paul munn — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 12:14:25 -0000

"...freedom is the gift of God..."

Despite what those red, white, and blue bumper stickers say, freedom is free.

Re: Independence day sort of

Zack Allen — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 00:28:33 -0000

Awesome article. Do you use Twitter, Joshua?

Re: Independence day sort of

Facebook User — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:32:41 -0000

Freedom is as freedom does...

For myself, I am meditating on this quote from Richard Bellah:

"To what extent can we help America become a responsible empire and to what extent must we stand against empire altogether?"